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Genunine 3646D Kampfschwimmer on Bay. 
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Watch Wizard
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Post Genunine 3646D Kampfschwimmer on Bay.
Hello people.
I saw this listing on Ebay, which certainly does not go unnoticed by the high cost.

https://www.ebay.de/itm/Very-rare-Kampfschwimmer-Rolex-Panerai-3646-Type-D-mit-Werk-Rolex-618-Typ-1/352245251077?hash=item520373fc05:g:s10AAOSwRJ9XgVoa

I thought ... it will be genuine!
What do you think about it?
Genuine or Perfect rebuild?

I'm curious to know your opinion, especially from experts in vintage Panerai.

Cheers.

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Tue Jan 02, 2018 1:59 pm
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Post Re: Genunine 3646D Kampfschwimmer on Bay.
Hard to say whether it is genuine or not.

It looks too good to be true in my opinion.

This dial thing, why would someone wish to swap dials...?

I get the feeling that it is a good build, but I am not that experienced.


Wed Jan 03, 2018 9:57 am
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Post Re: Genunine 3646D Kampfschwimmer on Bay.
Yoda wrote:
Hard to say whether it is genuine or not.

It looks too good to be true in my opinion.

This dial thing, why would someone wish to swap dials...?

I get the feeling that it is a good build, but I am not that experienced.


Isnt that possible to find out with movement serial ? I am wondering if they have a records from that period


Wed Jan 03, 2018 10:08 am
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Post Re: Genunine 3646D Kampfschwimmer on Bay.
I knew I had seen this one somewhere else...

http://www.vintagepanerai.com/2016/03/11/ref-3646-type-d-with-brass-dial-eppli/

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3646 with Genuine NOS dial, Elinvar Rolex, blued hands http://www.homageforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=26&p=466374#p466374
3646 with Genuine NOS dial, 616/618 conversion, gold hands http://www.homageforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=37690
47mm Egiziano http://www.homageforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=38208


Wed Jan 03, 2018 1:11 pm
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Post Re: Genunine 3646D Kampfschwimmer on Bay.
Anyway, the price seems too high. Recently, a 3646 with California dial sold at Phillips for $60k plus auction fees.

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3646 with Genuine NOS dial, Elinvar Rolex, blued hands http://www.homageforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=26&p=466374#p466374
3646 with Genuine NOS dial, 616/618 conversion, gold hands http://www.homageforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=37690
47mm Egiziano http://www.homageforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=38208


Wed Jan 03, 2018 1:12 pm
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Post Re: Genunine 3646D Kampfschwimmer on Bay.
Some years ago there were some cases that were spot on until you saw the lugs drilled through, even had perfect reproductions of the internals of the crown and lead gaskets all the way. Now it was expensive and only a few were completed. I have one for a customer it was gorgeous!

The dial looks like a southy dow and the kep dial way to easy to reproduce. Now the hands those look good.
The fact the gaskets look in good shape sends up a flag as they get crushed like a oil crush gasket. And as thin as cheap aluminum foil.

Just my two cents worth, aside what collector would sell something like that on ebay?

(Sorry bad day messing with frozen pipes[POUTING FACE])


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Wed Jan 03, 2018 6:00 pm
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Post Re: Genunine 3646D Kampfschwimmer on Bay.
But there are a lot of rare watches (legitimate ones) that have sold on eBay.

Regarding the hands, it looks like they have the bevel around the center. That seems to be the one thing we have not been able to replicate. Any thoughts on the hands?

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3646 with Genuine NOS dial, Elinvar Rolex, blued hands http://www.homageforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=26&p=466374#p466374
3646 with Genuine NOS dial, 616/618 conversion, gold hands http://www.homageforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=37690
47mm Egiziano http://www.homageforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=38208


Wed Jan 03, 2018 6:35 pm
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Post Genunine 3646D Kampfschwimmer on Bay.
I think the hands look gen.


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Wed Jan 03, 2018 7:56 pm
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Post Re: Genunine 3646D Kampfschwimmer on Bay.
It's funny we can hardly tell a gen from a build :)
Imho it's all gen, only the Cali dial I might have some doubts because the indices look so evenly lumed.

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Wed Jan 03, 2018 9:43 pm
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Post Re: Genunine 3646D Kampfschwimmer on Bay.
5ah1n wrote:
Yoda wrote:
Hard to say whether it is genuine or not.

It looks too good to be true in my opinion.

This dial thing, why would someone wish to swap dials...?

I get the feeling that it is a good build, but I am not that experienced.


Isnt that possible to find out with movement serial ? I am wondering if they have a records from that period


Movement serial number is shown in one of the pictures, 7527900 dates it to 1944 according to info I found on the web.

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Thu Jan 04, 2018 2:04 am
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Post Re: Genunine 3646D Kampfschwimmer on Bay.
If it’s not genuine it sure looks the part and has been covered before.


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Project list:
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Panerai 3646 Gen California Dial Esdee re-case w/ Rolex 618
Bronze mini 6152 no CG for my groomsmen!
Rolerai Bronze 6154 w/ ETA 6498
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Thu Jan 04, 2018 7:29 am
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Post Re: Genunine 3646D Kampfschwimmer on Bay.
I'm back ...
It's interesting how everyone has tried to understand and interpret the authenticity of such an expensive piece for sale on Ebay.
Only later I saw that it is also on sale on Crono24.
I do not consider myself an expert ... but many things do not convince me.
Making a comparison with the Vintage Panerai site ... known discrepancies on the shape of the case.
For example these:

Vintage Panerai
Image

Piece on sale
Image

I repeat ... maybe I'm wrong ... but something does not convince me.
However, I thank you all for answering .... my curiosity is so great.

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1) 6152/1 LP 1950 > http://www.homageforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=37950


Thu Jan 04, 2018 3:33 pm
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Post Re: Genunine 3646D Kampfschwimmer on Bay.
https://perezcope.com/2016/07/24/vintag ... 46-260818/


Thu Jan 04, 2018 8:26 pm
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Post Re: Genunine 3646D Kampfschwimmer on Bay.
Torgoen wrote:
known discrepancies on the shape of the case.

But these cases were hand finished, and there are discrepancies among legitimate watches.

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Projects:
3646 with Genuine NOS dial, Elinvar Rolex, blued hands http://www.homageforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=26&p=466374#p466374
3646 with Genuine NOS dial, 616/618 conversion, gold hands http://www.homageforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=37690
47mm Egiziano http://www.homageforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=38208


Fri Jan 05, 2018 1:35 am
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Post Re: Genunine 3646D Kampfschwimmer on Bay.
riesco wrote:
Torgoen wrote:
known discrepancies on the shape of the case.

But these cases were hand finished, and there are discrepancies among legitimate watches.
+1


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Project list:
Panerai 3646 Type H w/ SF240
Panerai 3646 2533 w/ Rolex 666
Panerai 6152 no CG 4-liner w/ SF240
Panerai 3646 Orange Indices Esdee re-case w/ Rolex 618
Panerai 3646 Gen California Dial Esdee re-case w/ Rolex 618
Bronze mini 6152 no CG for my groomsmen!
Rolerai Bronze 6154 w/ ETA 6498
Panerai 6154 creme dial w/ ETA 6498
Rolex 6200 Silix Build
Panerai 6152/1 with CG w/ SF240


Fri Jan 05, 2018 3:58 am
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